Is Bad Martial Arts Good Exercise?
Wednesday, September 27, 2006
Healthline
This week marked several beginnings. The equinox began the journey of the sun away from the northern hemisphere bringing longer nights. The festivals of Ramadan, St. Sophia, Navarati and others celebrate origins and understanding. The university semester began, including the full-to-capacity martial arts class I teach on Tuesday nights at Temple U's Center City campus.
When I arrived, students were sitting on the floor waiting. Some sat in bad rounded posture that you know is unhealthy at your desk. They straightened when I asked them to. In past semesters there were students who refused. Once, one stormed out shouting she didn't understand why she had to sit straight when class hadn't started yet. She didn't know that class is always in session.
Students got their equipment - bending wrong to yank weights out of bins. I told them, "Healthy bending. This class is for health." Some didn't understand the connection. Others tapped those still bending wrong, "Teacher says bend your legs." Several looked surprised. One said, "I'm getting leg exercise before class even begins." I told her that class is always in session. I reminded students to use healthy bending at home and work for every time they bend (Disc Pain - Not a Mystery, Easy to Fix). I showed them how to get more exercise by helping others who came in late.
We began stances. Students sometimes have a stereotyped idea, sometimes learned from aerobic boxing classes. They stand with shoulders hunched up, upper back rounded, head and chin jutting forward, and their behind tilted out in back. I mimicked them. They giggled at how bad it looks. I told them, "You don't look tough. You look ninety." It's true that you use shoulders to block some strikes, but you are not supposed to hunch. Don't do things to harm your neck in order to protect your neck. Overarching your lower back so that your behind tilts out in back is a frequent cause of back pain in daily life (Fixing the Commonest Source of "Mystery" Lower Back Pain) and injury when giving or receiving a blow. It's silly to go to boxing class and beat up yourself.
Look at the photo above. It shows terrible positioning that injures, and perpetuates the tightness that causes more troubles. When you lift one leg to kick (or stretch or take the stairs), notice if your other leg pulls forward. That shows tightness in the front of your hip. Instead, stand straight and keep the standing leg from pulling forward. Don't round your body to lift your leg. You will get built-in anterior hip stretch, one of the places you need to stretch most, and prevent several problems that I will cover soon.
The point of exercise is to improve life. It is missing the point to exercise in unhealthy ways, training unhealthy habits. If you are interested in learning how to retrain healthy movement in martial arts or aerobic boxing classes that you transfer to daily life, let me know and I will post more on what my students learn.
Book:
- Healthy Martial Arts - www.DrBookspan.com/books. Winner of the Black Belt Hall of Fame Readers Choice Award.
- Disc Pain - Not a Mystery, Easy to Fix
- Fixing the Commonest Source of "Mystery" Lower Back Pain
- Fast Fitness - Hidden Source of Groin Pulls
- Fast Fitness - Don't Shorten Hip When Stretching Hamstring
- Contest: What Does It Take To Sit Upright?
- Black Belt Hall of Fame - Black Belts and Black Tie
- Click the label martial arts, below.
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Read and contribute your own success stories of these methods. Before asking questions, see if your answers are already here - click labels under posts, links in posts, archives at right, and the Fitness Fixer Index. Subscribe to The Fitness Fixer, free. Click "updates via e-mail" (under trumpet) upper right.
For answers to personal medical questions - Replies to Medical Questions. Limited Class spaces for personal evaluation. Top students may apply to certify through DrBookspan.com/Academy. See Dr. Bookspan's Books.
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Read and contribute your own success stories of these methods. Before asking questions, see if your answers are already here - click labels under posts, links in posts, archives at right, and the Fitness Fixer Index. Subscribe to The Fitness Fixer, free. Click "updates via e-mail" (under trumpet) upper right.
For answers to personal medical questions - Replies to Medical Questions. Limited Class spaces for personal evaluation. Top students may apply to certify through DrBookspan.com/Academy. See Dr. Bookspan's Books.
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Labels: hamstring, hip, injury, knee, leg strength, leg stretch, lower back, martial arts, neck, posture, shoulder, strength, stretch, upper back
12 Comments:
At Monday, October 02, 2006 9:01:00 PM,
Anonymous said…
I would love to see more of the do's and don't's of martial arts and kickboxing. I think I might understand what you mean by my standing leg "pulling forward," but a correct picture along with the incorrect picture would help immensely. Thanks so much!
At Thursday, October 05, 2006 9:35:00 PM,
Healthline said…
Glad to post more. This week I covered not sticking the behind out in back, the way so many people think is fitness, but is instead, injurious and ineffective to generate strong movement. Glad to see from your other comment that you already tried reducing the lower back overarching by tilting the hip and found that it works. Next week's class is supposed to work on the leg pulling forward phenomenon. I will post how they do.
When you lift one leg, your other leg will rise along with it if your hip is tight. You can see this often in gyms (and "health" magazines) when someone lies on their back lifting one leg to stretch their hamstrings. The other leg comes off the floor. Worse, many places teach you to let the knee bend or even to deliberately bend it. They say that is the way to "protect the back," but what it does is keep a tight hip tight and reduce the hamstring stretch. It even predisposes for groin pulls. I'm working on posts showing this when lying face up to stretch hamstrings, to kick in martial arts, dance, and aerobics classes, running, and even walking and taking the stairs.
My book Healthy Martial Arts is a good resource for changing many practices to be stronger and healthier. Keep your good and intelligent work coming.
At Monday, May 21, 2007 4:17:00 PM,
Jolie Bookspan, M.Ed, PhD, FAWM said…
phatmac, for comparison photos of how hip tightness pulls the standing leg forward when kicking (or raising the leg for any activity such as taking the stairs), check Common Exercises Teach Hip Tightness When Kicking, Stretching, and on the Stairs
At Monday, July 16, 2007 6:44:00 PM,
Kip said…
I injured my back 4/06, and after all the tests showed DDD but no real herniation despite radiculopathy. I had to take off work for the past 9 months to rest. My back was feeling unstable for the first 4 months, but now just having ankle aches, lateral thigh aches and heel tingles at times. Have been able to hike without pain, cycle 30 miles, but not able to do MA. the kicking and punching are too much for my back. Your articles on proper positioning in terms of hip and back are helpful, altho it is the force as well as the trunk rotation that gets my back or LE symptoms going. Have been told that my MA is over.
At Monday, August 06, 2007 6:05:00 PM,
Jolie Bookspan, M.Ed, PhD, FAWM said…
Kip, don't worry. Martial arts does not have to be over. Many martial artists come to me as patients, also told to give it up. I use healthy martial arts techniques as their rehab - see my web page Inspiring Patient Stories.
A few points:
- Rest can make you weaker.
- You are not supposed to injure yourself when you move, for martial arts or any activity.
- There are people who clomp through walking and other "low impact" activity with worse body mechanics and higher impact than a good boxer or martial artist fights.
- Several specific medicines people commonly take, both prescription and non-prescription, are often a large hidden source of pain. Then more medicines are prescribed for those effects. It is now known that many of the medicines are not even necessary and the original problem can be resolved without them.
- Discs heal. It does not have to be permanent.
- "DDD" or degenerative disc disease is not a disease. It is wrongly named. It is an injury, not a disease process. It can heal if you let it. Often it is not even the disc that is the source of the pain, but the usual bad mechanics and over-arching the lower back, causing mysterious chronic pain. A (painless) degenerated disc may show up on the scans and pain is ascribed to that.
Try the technique in Throw a Stronger Punch (or Push a Car or Stroller) Using This Back Pain Reduction Technique and let me know. Martial arts is to improve the mind and body, not harm yourself or others. Often, your opponents will not harm you as much as you will harm yourself.
At Monday, August 06, 2007 6:24:00 PM,
Kip said…
Thanks for your reply! I am working on the pelvic position in general, altho I don't tend to arch my back as a rule, never was very comfortable. As for rest, I haven't been lying in bed, just not working due to the physicality of my tasks. As for MA, I have been trying to implement your suggestion from the article, which works well, as long as my punches are not forceful. The unknown here is that a PMR specialist saw instability in the L4 segment from my MRI and my complaints of feeling clunking in my spine along with a feeling of instability, almost subluxation, and that is what gets aggravated by punching or kicking with force. Perhaps should wait another 6months for punch and kick?
At Thursday, August 09, 2007 11:49:00 AM,
Jolie Bookspan, M.Ed, PhD, FAWM said…
Kip, good work using the info and getting better so far. Don't worry, we'll figure the rest. If you're not comfortable, it's not right yet. Do you feel a difference when you do Throw a Stronger Punch (or Push a Car or Stroller) Using This Back Pain Reduction Technique?
There is a difference in mobility and instability, and both need to be observed in motion, not on a still scan. Even with instability, you use your muscles to hold an injured area from clunking and slipping around. Then it can heal. If you don't, it will continue to shear and yank. I'd need to see you moving. I often see people who come in to be checked for pain that continues after all their treatments and surgeries, some who are full of muscles from "doing their exercises" but not maintaining segments in normal motion during exercise or daily life.
Next, there is punching and kicking form, which is not supposed to rattle your own teeth, no matter how forceful. Arms and legs need to contribute their own shock absorption from both the muscles and how the movement is done. Come to a workshop some time and I can check what you're doing. Send mpegs and photos.
Continued use of anti-inflammatory and related pain medicines can impede healing and cause painful problems of their own. Specific common medicines and herbs and a long list of "health" supplements lead to a surprising array of uncomfortable effects that people often pop a few more anti-inflammatory pills, or sleeping pills, or anti-anxiety pills, or others to combat. All potentially a hidden source of problems (different classes do different things - need a long post to list the differences, just trying to get a general concept here). If you're on a list of medicines and herbs and supplements, rethink them.
Stop exercises that load the discs more than the exercise is worth, like crunches, leg lifts, and toe touches. Don't sit rounded at desk, TV, or exercise. Don't sit on the bed first thing in the morning. Instead, lie face down and prop slightly on elbows until there is no pain. This straightens you first thing, and gets you ready for the wall test, pectoral stretch and trap stretch I wrote about in the neck pain articles. Are you doing them? Important for the lower back. Rounding the upper back loads the lower discs too.
There are more effective and healthy ways to stretch the hamstrings and work the abs and back. My book Healthy Martial arts (www.DrBookspan.com/books) gives a full explanation and illustrated guide of what to do instead.
At Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:00:00 PM,
Kip said…
Thank you for your comments and suggestions. I have eliminated the crunchies that I did as ab ex, and substituted your stabilizing ab exs instead, my AM heel tingle symptoms have resolved. I have been paying attention to my upper back posture with sitting and standing, using the stretching suggestions from your site, and am only taking ibuprofen as needed, probably 3 tablets 1-2 times per week, and no other drugs or herbs. Yes, when I throw a punch with the correct pelvic position from your site photo, I notice better tolerance than with no stabilization or with too much arch in low back. However, I have yet to be able to tolerate punching with force on a standing bag, it causes a feeling of instability later that evening, not right away. So I am practicing your position but working on posture and technique for stabilizing but not using force. Have noticed increase in tolerance to form practice in terms of higher kicks. Started with ankle height and now at knee height. Will try to get someone to take photos of me. As for a class, that would be ideal but I am in Northern Calif, so may have some difficulties. I really appreciate your time, as my MA is VERY important to me, and none of my docs have understood that.
At Tuesday, September 11, 2007 8:49:00 PM,
Unknown said…
Your conversation with Kip really encouraged me. I'm a 37 year old man and a year ago I was found to have herniated disks from L-4 to S-1 from DDD. A year later I am still experiencing lower back pain; however, exercise brings much relief along with the core strengthening and stretching exercises my physical therapist placed me on. I've actually managed to incorporate running up to a mile a day and upperbody freeweight exercises with dumbbells, etc. All of this said, I have always wanted to learn jujitsu and believe I've found a sensei who will work with me. My docs and my phys. therapist all assure me that there's no reason to hold back so long as I focus on stretching, particularly the hamstrings (which I constantly struggle with tightness) and listen to my back. Now that you've heard my 'life story' (sorry), do you have any thoughts or suggestions or stories of any other folks that were in similar shoes to my own that very much wanted to pursue this sort of thing? Thanks much in advance.
At Friday, September 14, 2007 3:18:00 PM,
Jolie Bookspan, M.Ed, PhD, FAWM said…
Lee, stay encouraged.
First, you can herniate a disc from bad hamstring stretches. Most conventional hamstring stretches are the opposite of what a disc needs - Sitting Badly Isn't Magically Healthy by Calling It a Hamstring Stretch. The stretches you are doing may be part of why you have continuing back pain.
The main thing to know is that a disc can heal and stop hurting, like any other injury. Degenerative disc disease is misnamed; it is not a disease, or a condition that must persist once you have it. It is an injury, almost primarily from unhealthful movement patterns. Once you stop pushing the disc outward with bad biomechanics, it can heal quickly. Your long standing pain means you are still pushing it back out. It does not mean reducing activity. With good mechanics, you can do more than before. It is also important to change to healthful movement to prevent the next disc from deteriorating from the same bad habits. Use all the links and comments in Fix Disc Pain Without Surgery, understand more with The Cause of Disc and Back Pain, and see how disc injury is a simple mechanics process that you can easily reverse with Disc Pain - Not a Mystery, Easy to Fix. Apply the stabilizing info in the links and replies to Kip to your martial arts and daily life.
Everything should reduce pain right away. If not, check that you are applying it right. Get the book Healthy Martial Arts and show it to your teachers too. Don't wait. Heal up now and be happy. Don't live with injury or pain.
At Tuesday, February 26, 2008 12:35:00 PM,
Anonymous said…
I'm sure glad I have found your web-site. I have several issues. If you can help me, I will be eternally grateful.
I have been in Taekwondo for close to 2 years and love it. But I am always getting injured. I've had lower back issues in the past...these have gotten better but it is always tight. My most recent challenges are my adductor muscles.Seemed to be predominantly L sided, but have been sick for the last week. I have a deep cough and when walking just last evening I felt a VERY painful pull in the R group of adductors. It has repeated if I cough and are walking or standing with my R lg fully extended. It's very painful along the length of the medial thigh. The L is sore as well. This has been a chronic problem for me. Any ideas how I may resolve the tenderness? Little Hx here: L knee injury 10/07-contusion to anterior femur and under patella. R knee ACL repair 1/02-injury to hamstrings while in rehabilitation.
THANK YOU!!!!-Patty Edelstein-CO
At Friday, February 29, 2008 4:22:00 PM,
Jolie Bookspan, M.Ed, PhD, FAWM said…
Hello Patty, one major contributor to tight adductors, or muscles that bring the leg toward the other, plus damage to the knee from tight muscles yanking during the kick, is the bad positioning featured in this post that you replied to.
Look at the standing leg in the photo and see that it is pulled forward, instead of getting the stretch in those muscles by holding straighter positioning. The same occurs when lying on the back to stretch hamstrings with one leg overhead. Do not bend the other leg, but leave it flat on the floor. I am aware that some sources recommend to bend the knee to somehow "protect" the back, but you control your own spine positioning, not by bending your knee. Bending the knee loses an important functional stretch. Comparison photos showing good and bad standing leg positioning are in Common Exercises Teach Hip Tightness When Kicking, Stretching, and on the Stairs. In martial arts, you don't want a locked leg, of course, but get the functional stretch that prevents adductor and groin muscle tightness.
For lower back, read and try all the links in the replies to Kip and Lee. Keep us posted of your improvements.
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